272 points by ikawe 2 days ago | 13 comments
ikawe 1 day ago
Background:

Mapping applications split up data into "tiles" so you can download only the data you are currently looking at. For example, you don't want to download the entire planet, just to look at your own neighborhood.

Historically, these tiles were literally images that the client application (i.e. web map) could "tile" side by side to cover the part of the map you were looking at. Now we refer to those images as "raster" tiles, to differentiate them with "vector" tiles.

Rather than a rendered image, Vector tiles contain the raw data that you could use to render such an image. Vector tiles allow a smaller file size and more flexibility. For example, with vector tiles you can crisply render at partial zoom levels, keeping lines sharp and avoid pixelating text. The client can also have customizable styles - hiding certain layers or accentuating others from the vector tiles.

Vector tiles are not new technology. For example, Google Maps started using them over a decade ago. So why has it taken so long for OpenStreetMap.org? One reason is no doubt a lack of engineering capacity. There were also concerns about older and less powerful clients hardware not being up to the task, but that concern has lessened over time.

OpenStreetMap also has some unique requirements. It is a community edited database, and users want to see their edits soon (immediately really). It's not feasible to dynamically generate every tile request from the latest data, so caching is essential. Still, to minimize the amount of time tiles will be stale, a lot of work went into being able to quickly regenerate stale tiles before the new vector tiles were rolled out.

stevage 1 day ago
>Vector tiles are not new technology.

Yeah, it really is not. Mapbox Vector Tiles spec came out in 2014, and they've been absolutely standard across all (non-government) web mapping for at least the last 5 years.

gregoriol 1 day ago
Indeed almost everyone except Apple's MapKit library for in-app native maps integration is using vector these days.
hopelite 1 day ago
Could you explain why you say that? My understanding is that rasterized tiles are only a graceful degradation when necessary in MapKit, while vector is default, as the behavior and experience would indicate.
gregoriol 4 hours ago
I was referring to using custom vector tiles like the ones in the post with MapKit, not Apple's tiles. The MKTileOverlay is the only way to do it and it only supports bitmap tiles.
showcaseearth 21 hours ago
+1. Google launched their (proprietary) vector tiles in 2013 as well, and I'd even argue that vector has been the standard well over 5 years now.
awkward 22 hours ago
Tiles aren't just about data selection, they're also about caching. By turning a continuous domain (any part of the world at any scale) into a series of discrete requests (a grid of tiles at several fixed scales), maps become a series of cacheable requests.
stevage 1 day ago
For anyone who wants to actually try the new layer, it's called "Shortbread" and can be accessed under the layers selector. Or use this link: https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map&layers=S

The blog post could do a better job of surfacing that bit!

You can compare it to the existing vector tile layer created by MapTiler, which mimics the classic raster tile style: https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map&layers=V

severak_cz 1 day ago
Oh but that default style for Shortbread is so ugly! No contrast, missing details and lots of information lost.

Hopefully it's vector tiles and information are there (I checked in Maputik) so it's possible to create my own style (which I will definitely try).

MapNavTom 1 day ago
There is also the MapTiler OMT style for OpenMapTiles, which uses Vector Tiles. It is a close copy of the Standard OSM map style. It appeared at the same time as Shortbread on the osm.org website.
reddalo 1 day ago
I agree, it's super close to the classical OSM style, but some things are missing, e.g. roads that are currently planned or in the building phase.
MapNavTom 1 day ago
Yes, buildings under construction aren't there yet either. OMT is OpenSource though, so you can make a pull request: https://github.com/openmaptiles/openmaptiles
severak_cz 1 day ago
Yeah. MapTiler has much better styles in general.
showcaseearth 21 hours ago
The lack of boundaries below national level is off-putting. Both the style and the tile spec itself seem to need a lot of refinement... highways look like a patchwork at low zoom. I had also thought shortbread excluded a lot of POI types, but maybe I need to review again.

But that's not to diminish the accomplishment overall here for the OSM page itself– this is an awesome step forward!

wiredfool 19 hours ago
OSM has always overdone boundaries in my opinion, the raster tiles show national/international waters and electoral districts, which are of limited use for most purposes.
timeon 1 day ago
Yeah only motorways are highlighted everything else is faded in background.
maelito 2 days ago
In case you wonder how much time / resources it takes to generate vector tiles, I'm running benchmarks with Tilemaker here for https://cartes.app

https://github.com/systemed/tilemaker/issues/839

mourner 22 hours ago
Also worth checking out https://github.com/onthegomap/planetiler, which maybe a bit less mature, but is much faster than Tilemaker.
maelito 19 hours ago
Is it ? The benchmark section says 42 m for a 128 Gb machine with 64 CPU.
economyballoon 1 day ago
I am sorry but what is "300 Go RAM" 300 Go? I only know GB/GiB.
leca 1 day ago
OP is probably French or his native tongue is French. Byte is “Octet” in French and typically you’ll see Go = Gigaoctet which is the same as GB.
globular-toast 1 day ago
Also more technically correct as byte never "officially" meant 8 bits, but octet is unambiguous.
julienfr112 1 day ago
<troll>like measuring lengths in meters</troll>
farkanoid 1 day ago
It's basically French for GB (Go = Gigaoctet)
dolmen 1 day ago
Many important details are not visible anymore:

  - gates on private pathways 
  - shop names
johannes1234321 1 day ago
The choices are tough, also in details: Which shops to show in busy areas at which zoom level?

But mind: openstreetmap.org is ment as a developer site, for developers to see their changes quickly. The official idea is that other people should take the data and do "nice" things elsewhere. But of course reality is that users want to use openstreetmap.org as alternative to Google maps ...

ikawe 19 hours ago
Official? I've never heard this as official doctrine. Can you point me to anything official?

I'd love to see OpenStreetMap.org be more directly useful to more people, rather than only as a "developer site".

Piskvorrr 5 hours ago
Well that's a bit of a balancing act, isn't it? "Why isn't this feature on the site, it would be more useful to me; also, that feature is annoying and useless to me" - says literally everyone.

Thus, we get a built-in editor (less friction, yay/too rudimentary, boo) and popups (OSM events, yay/Popups are now everywhere, boo). And endless discussions on "this should be more/less prominent."

I don't think there's any official edict, but the approach "I don't like this and I'll make my own version" is at the very least workable (as opposed to, say, Google Maps).

notachatbot123 1 day ago
All the more reason to show rather more than less data.
lutoma 1 day ago
Personally I'm quite happy that these tiles cut down on the clutter in the original OSM tiles. It made it very hard for me to actually use them for navigation because there was just so much stuff everywhere.

For example the old tiles displayed rail tracks extremely prominently, which just aren't relevant 99% of the time even when traveling by train. In the vector tiles they're much more muted and thinner.

timeon 1 day ago
Yes but this one only highlights motorways which are used usually just for long distance drives.
wiredfool 19 hours ago
The nice thing is, that's just a style, not a property of the tiles. So if you want to alter the rendering, it's "just" a change to the style of that layer/attribute.
amluto 23 hours ago
What happened to maps trying to make the names of most or all streets visible? It looks like the vector layer on the web viewer is sort of trying to show some street names, but it seems extremely buggy right now — names appear and then disappear again when making small zoom adjustments.

Not that Apple Maps or Google Maps are much better in this regard.

colkassad 1 day ago
What's the impediment to not providing daily or weekly planet-wide mbtiles similar to the availability of OSM pbfs on AWS open data buckets[1]?

[1] https://registry.opendata.aws/osm/

tppiotrowski 1 day ago
I think mbtiles are being phased out for pmtiles because no DB required and can be served from static storage like R2/S3 (with a worker but hopefully the worker part goes away and they support byte offset requests soon)
jtbaker 1 day ago
The worker isn’t required, having a z/x/y tile scheme just makes caching the tiles server side super easy.

Look at the network tab on https://pmtiles.io/#url=https%3A%2F%2Fdemo-bucket.protomaps....

stevage 1 day ago
You don't need a database to serve mbtiles. If you're deploying PMTiles somewhere that doesn't support byte offset requests, then they don't really have much advantage over mbtiles.
jamessb 22 hours ago
That depends what you mean by needing a database. MBtiles files are SQLite database files, so you need a SQLite process running somewhere to extract the requested tiles.
sureglymop 1 day ago
An mbtiles file is just an SQLite db which can store image or vector tiles which can be very useful.

It's great for exploring tiles but it essentially doesn't support range queries/requests, which pmtiles does.

sp8962 23 hours ago
To answer the question: somebody needs to do the initial work and it's a further moving part that needs to be kept running (as the other responses point out such a distribution would likely use PMTiles as a container format). Given the current finances and staffing of the OSMF likely not top priority.
colkassad 23 hours ago
But they've done the work and are serving them now, just wondering why they don't just dump a copy on AWS. Thanks for answering!
butz 21 hours ago
While vector tiles are often marketed as faster loading ones, and it is true in OSM case, I would like to see apples to apples comparison: vector tiles with same level of detail as original OSM raster tiles. Maybe someone already has such vector style built?
perrygeo 19 hours ago
To everyone with complaints about the new "Shortbread" styling, I agree that it's not perfect but that's kinda missing the point. The real story is that vector tiles have the styling applied client-side so anyone can tweak the look with a little javascript.

The prior raster tiles have the style baked in; if you want a new look, you need to generate a new image. So each map publisher ends up running their own data and server infrastructure just to tweak the style.

The vector tile approach means a single (cacheable) asset can be used in many different maps. Huge win. If you don't like the style, you can make your own without having to literally download the planet.

davidkwast 2 days ago
Nice. I already use Vector Tiles on my backend. But it is nice to have other sources like this.
maxerickson 2 days ago
A feature goal for this deployment was that the tiles would update continuously, keeping up with changes that people are making to the OpenStreetMap database.

Providing that feedback is one of the main purposes of the site.

wiz21c 1 day ago
does a vector tile use more or less memory than a raster tile ? I mean, on average, in OSM.
neomantra 22 hours ago
This comment is a reminder that OSM Vector Tiles is sponsored work. It is exciting to see the deployment of it — congrats to the team!

If you find value in it, consider donating any amount to the OpenStreetMap Foundation.

https://blog.openstreetmap.org/2024/02/11/2024-announcing-th...

eulgro 2 days ago
I had no idea what vector tiles were and the page doesn't explain it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vector_tiles

kurtoid 2 days ago
Here's how I understand it: Previously, OpenStreetMap's tile endpoints would serve pre-rasterized PNG images, so zooming in on a tile could cause it to get blurry, until your client requests a new, zoomed in tile. Now, they can serve tiles in SVG format, which scale better
orblivion 1 day ago
Someone please correct me if I'm wrong here, but I think there's an additional benefit.

Traditional process is:

OSM Database -> PNGs -> Your screen

The first arrow decides what data to pull out and how to draw it.

The new process is:

OSM Database -> Vector Tiles -> Your Screen

The first arrow decides what data to pull out. The second arrow decides how to draw it. So given your vector tiles, you can choose and tweak the style that it's drawn as, deciding how (and if) to display certain things. And you can tweak that in your browser. That's useful for devs and users. "Night Mode", "Show bike lanes" (maybe?), etc.

Also relevant is that the vector tile is not only in a couple formats (pmtiles, mbtiles) but conforms to a couple different schemas (Shortbread, OpenMapTiles) which determines what kinds of data shows up. For instance (I'm just making up this example) one schema might have "big" "medium" and "small" roads. Another schema might just have "big" and "small". The transformation process will decide which kinds of roads in the OSM database map on to which type of road in the schema. (I think it turns out that you can't realistically just pull out all of the OSM database data, you have to pare it down). And then certain styles (Americana, etc) work for specific schemas, deciding things like "big roads are black", etc.

stevage 1 day ago
The enormous difference from an infrastructure standpoint is where the arrows are happening and how much effort it is.

> OSM Database -> PNGs

This is a tile rendering farm. It takes a lot of compute power and has to be redone every time a style changes or data changes.

> OSM Database -> Vector Tiles

This is a relatively cheap data extraction process. It has to be redone when data changes.

> PNGs -> Your screen

This is extremely simple.

> Vector Tiles -> Your Screen

This is pretty complex and hard to do fast. Mapbox GL JS is the leader here and they have put a lot of resources into doing it well and fast. Maplibre GL JS is the fork, which is decent, and there are also Leaflet and OpenLayers options.

Source: This is basically my life for the last 10 years.

severak 19 hours ago
Rendering of Vector Tiles is not that hard as all the geometry is already processed, polygons assembled and data sorted. If you have good source of vector tiles renderer itself can be relatively dumb.

I was able to implement relatively straightforward renderer in Nim language[0].

I have encountered only three hard parts:

- rendering map labels on paths (this is really hard!) - how to render labels not to be clipped by tile boundary (I had some ideas but did not implemented it yet) - collisions between labels and symbols

[0] - https://github.com/severak/lunarender3/

SigmundA 1 day ago
More like

OSM Database -> PNGs -> PNG Decoder in browser-> Your screen

vs

OSM Database -> Vector Tiles -> MaplibreGL.js -> WebGL -> Your Screen

bugsMarathon88 1 day ago
Could you please comment on any security implications of executing community-generated vector tile content, compared to classic PNG decoding?
lxgr 1 day ago
I don't think anything's being executed here, in the same sense that both PDF (without JavaScript, at least) and JPEG are "data only", even though one uses vectors while the other only supports raster graphics.
SigmundA 1 day ago
The security surface area will be either the png decoder or webgl, both are pretty well scrutinized but if I had to pick I would the png decoder is less likely to have a security issue compared to webgl.

Does't really matter because both png or webgl are available to any website at anytime.

fsflover 1 day ago
If you care about security implications of reading untrusted data, you may be interested in trying Qubes OS, which isolates apps by running everything in VMs. My daily driver, can't recommend it enough.
rjh29 2 days ago
SVG tiles use less data too, and can be recoloured/restyled.
SigmundA 1 day ago
Not SVG
maelito 2 days ago
> so zooming in on a tile could cause it to get blurry, until your client requests a new, zoomed in tile. Now, they can serve tiles in SVG format, which scale better

They still are blurry, because openstreetmap.org uses a JS library that does not seem to support vector tiles :/

orblivion 1 day ago
Make sure it's set to the "Shortbread" layer. Look for the "Layers" menu on the right.
Stephen304 1 day ago
Hmm I tried the shortbread layer and while it looks nice it still pixelates when zooming in until it loads the new zoom level
orblivion 1 day ago
I guess you're right. I see the same on my desktop Firefox on Linux. But on my Android phone it's pretty smooth.
Stephen304 1 day ago
It seems to just not work in Firefox for me, it's the same for me on FF Android but in Chrome it's beautiful! Constant text size while zooming and it's super smooth.

Edit: It also weirdly doesn't work on Chrome on Linux for me either, only Chrome on android. Oh well, hopefully they can bring support everywhere eventually.

akdor1154 1 day ago
I just tested it and it's def vector here - Firefox Android. Looks great!
SigmundA 1 day ago
Not SVG, its Mapbox Vector tile format which is like Geojson coded in protobuf it is then rendered to raster in the browser using webgl typically.

https://github.com/mapbox/vector-tile-spec/tree/master/2.0

SVG is an XML based format that browsers render naitively, completely different.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SVG

dbetteridge 2 days ago
Basically that + vector tiles can store information about the tile, styles, objects or buildings etc
stevage 1 day ago
Fun fact: I wrote a lot of that article :)

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Vector_tiles&oldi...